Comments on: They Don’t Know

By: Kirstie

Kirstie — Mon, 01 Nov 2010 01:20:24 +0000

Perhaps looking at models has another type of value. I think of models as threads in the tapestry of students’ prior knowledge. Models help solve the lack of student ‘experience’ Simon writes about.

By: Nancy

Nancy — Wed, 06 May 2009 20:06:12 +0000

I’m guessing you teach high school (or maybe middle school)–here’s what I think. Kids do not THINK, they do not know how to think. Elementary schools are so routinized that kids are told what do do, what to write, to expect the right and only answer. By the time they get to high school they are zoombie-like. Maybe it would help to teach ‘thinking’ at the beginning of the year.

By: Todd

Todd — Sat, 25 Apr 2009 20:28:42 +0000

Simon, of course you can use my handouts. I post them for exactly that reason and I’m glad you see some possible use here. I think a few of the intro model paragraphs come from Writers INC. books, but other than that these come from my students. And even the Writers INC. stuff comes from students.

Tom, the main difference in those body paragraph models is that the writer has done their primary job of both having a point (there’s no thesis in that first paragraph; it’s all summary) and explaining the ideas (something paragraphs three and five fail to do). It’s not about academic style because we cover that elsewhere. They already have a fairly strong grasp on that and I don’t think any of these examples break that too much. It’s about whether or not the paragraphs even work. Quotations unexplained, focus changed midparagraph, incorrect details, missing information, evidence that does absolutely nothing to further the point, these are the things I tend to find work to exemplify at both ends of the spectrum.

By: Tom Hoffman

Tom Hoffman — Fri, 24 Apr 2009 13:56:11 +0000

What do you see as the primary difference between the “passing” and “non-passing” examples? The distinctions in your models are much more fine than I used in my (urban high school) English class. Skimming through them it seems that, notwithstanding usage glitches, the level of formality and academic style is the main distinguishing feature, and it isn’t that surprising that kids would, left to their own devices, like a less formal style.

By: Simon Oldaker

Simon Oldaker — Fri, 24 Apr 2009 09:22:55 +0000

This is interesting, given the pressure we are under to include pupils in the evaluation process, encourage self-evaluation, involve pupils in planning how learning goals are to be acheived, etc. The problem is, as you say, they don’t know. Get into a second or third language and they know even less.

This is a dilemma I feel more and more. I want to take the time for my pupils to figure things out on their own. The time invested should pay off, because they have to practice thinking and then feel that they own the result. This should pay off in all kinds of ways.

Trouble is, I often have your experience. They simply don’t have the background to respond to models the way I want. Maybe I have to go small. Take things one tiny step at a time so that they can slowly build up the skills and insight I’m looking for.

…can I use your handouts? Good stuff.